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	<title>Comments on: Searching For Signals</title>
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	<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/</link>
	<description>Just another Firedoglake weblog</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 23:28:30 -0600</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: macaquerman</title>
		<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/comment-page-1/#comment-5555</link>
		<dc:creator>macaquerman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 03:45:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/#comment-5555</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The blockade has been used to deny the Gazans  shipments of heavy weapons.&lt;br /&gt;
It has most definitely not been used to deny food as evidenced by many statements by relief agencies estimating that 75-80% of Gazans are dependent on such shipments.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The blockade has been used to deny the Gazans  shipments of heavy weapons.<br />
It has most definitely not been used to deny food as evidenced by many statements by relief agencies estimating that 75-80% of Gazans are dependent on such shipments.</p>
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		<title>By: lokywoky</title>
		<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/comment-page-1/#comment-5547</link>
		<dc:creator>lokywoky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 23:20:04 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;6500 tons of food for 1.5 million people?  for two weeks?  That’s a drop in the bucket.  The hospitals in Gaza are out of everything.  Many injured Palestinians are being turned away because they have no ability to treat them.  There is no fuel being allowed in, and Israel has cut the electricity grid so the hospitals were being run on portable generators.  But now there is no fuel.  There is no fuel for cooking either.  And very little for vehicles or anything else.  Large groups of people are going out into the relatively small ‘wild areas’ and gathering grass - for food.  Other agencies have said that they needed over 150 truckloads of food on a daily basis and we’re supposed to believe that 93 is enough for two weeks?  Please…&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;As far as Israel’s right to defend itself - that UN mandate applies to Gaza as well.  Why is Gaza not allowed to defend itself from the constant bombings, targetted assassinations, house-bulldozing, and other things perpetrated against the Palestinians by the Israelis?  What about this blockade - it is an act of war to prevent food from reaching a civilian population!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Israel is just as guilty as Hamas in this mess even though they portray themselves as the constant victims.  I find it hard to see them as victims when they have put up a wall with virtually no way out, and they control the openings - and then stop allowing vital necessities of life to get inside.  Your understanding of just what this blockade is about is not at all reality on the ground there.  And this blockade has been in place for over a year.  Do you not think that if you lived inside - couldn’t get out, couldn’t feed your family, couldn’t even cook food if you had any in the first place, you would try to do something?  I submit that you would be perfectly within your rights to do so.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Israel is not as big a victim as they have made the Palestinians, and while there is violence, it is on both sides.  But the bigger offender IMHO is Israel.  All you have to do is look at the numbers.  What is it, 4 dead Israelis and almost 500 Palestinians so far and more to come?  Yeah, Israel is a real victim here.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>6500 tons of food for 1.5 million people?  for two weeks?  That’s a drop in the bucket.  The hospitals in Gaza are out of everything.  Many injured Palestinians are being turned away because they have no ability to treat them.  There is no fuel being allowed in, and Israel has cut the electricity grid so the hospitals were being run on portable generators.  But now there is no fuel.  There is no fuel for cooking either.  And very little for vehicles or anything else.  Large groups of people are going out into the relatively small ‘wild areas’ and gathering grass &#8211; for food.  Other agencies have said that they needed over 150 truckloads of food on a daily basis and we’re supposed to believe that 93 is enough for two weeks?  Please…</p>
<p>As far as Israel’s right to defend itself &#8211; that UN mandate applies to Gaza as well.  Why is Gaza not allowed to defend itself from the constant bombings, targetted assassinations, house-bulldozing, and other things perpetrated against the Palestinians by the Israelis?  What about this blockade &#8211; it is an act of war to prevent food from reaching a civilian population!</p>
<p>Israel is just as guilty as Hamas in this mess even though they portray themselves as the constant victims.  I find it hard to see them as victims when they have put up a wall with virtually no way out, and they control the openings &#8211; and then stop allowing vital necessities of life to get inside.  Your understanding of just what this blockade is about is not at all reality on the ground there.  And this blockade has been in place for over a year.  Do you not think that if you lived inside &#8211; couldn’t get out, couldn’t feed your family, couldn’t even cook food if you had any in the first place, you would try to do something?  I submit that you would be perfectly within your rights to do so.</p>
<p>Israel is not as big a victim as they have made the Palestinians, and while there is violence, it is on both sides.  But the bigger offender IMHO is Israel.  All you have to do is look at the numbers.  What is it, 4 dead Israelis and almost 500 Palestinians so far and more to come?  Yeah, Israel is a real victim here.</p>
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		<title>By: macaquerman</title>
		<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/comment-page-1/#comment-5524</link>
		<dc:creator>macaquerman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 00:20:24 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;Please, there are LOTS of Americans who don’t share your support for the use of American-supplied weapons in this instance.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Please, there are LOTS of Americans who don’t share your support for the use of American-supplied weapons in this instance.</p>
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		<title>By: Amaliada</title>
		<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/comment-page-1/#comment-5501</link>
		<dc:creator>Amaliada</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 23:28:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/#comment-5501</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;How interesting the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.lrb.co.uk/v31/n01/roy_01_.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;statistics &lt;/a&gt;you quote about the blockade.  The United Nations agency charged with delivering aid, money, and foodstuffs to Gazans said that very little aid was getting in before last Saturday and it stands to reason that even less has been getting in since given that the IDF justified defying an Israeli Supreme Court ruling about letting in journalists the next time the Erez crossing was opened.  As we know, the crossing was opened to allow those residents of Gaza holding foreign passports to leave.  To date, no foreign journalists have been allowed to enter.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;It is difficult to get accurate, unbiased reporting if journalists are not allowed to do their job.  It is easy to get information - YouTube videos from both sides of the conflict, reporting by Israeli newspapers and quotes from Israeli politicians, and coverage from Al Jazeera in English along with the AP and Reuters.  But since no foreign journalists are allowed into the strip, it is hard to say what is true.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I am not an unbiased observer.  As long as American foreign aid and military hardware are used against a captive (if the borders are sealed and people are not allowed to leave at will, they are captive) population, I cannot remain unbiased.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How interesting the <a href="http://www.lrb.co.uk/v31/n01/roy_01_.html" rel="nofollow">statistics </a>you quote about the blockade.  The United Nations agency charged with delivering aid, money, and foodstuffs to Gazans said that very little aid was getting in before last Saturday and it stands to reason that even less has been getting in since given that the IDF justified defying an Israeli Supreme Court ruling about letting in journalists the next time the Erez crossing was opened.  As we know, the crossing was opened to allow those residents of Gaza holding foreign passports to leave.  To date, no foreign journalists have been allowed to enter.</p>
<p>It is difficult to get accurate, unbiased reporting if journalists are not allowed to do their job.  It is easy to get information &#8211; YouTube videos from both sides of the conflict, reporting by Israeli newspapers and quotes from Israeli politicians, and coverage from Al Jazeera in English along with the AP and Reuters.  But since no foreign journalists are allowed into the strip, it is hard to say what is true.</p>
<p>I am not an unbiased observer.  As long as American foreign aid and military hardware are used against a captive (if the borders are sealed and people are not allowed to leave at will, they are captive) population, I cannot remain unbiased.</p>
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		<title>By: endiem</title>
		<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/comment-page-1/#comment-5444</link>
		<dc:creator>endiem</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 22:27:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;Edwards’ sentiment was indeed encouraging. What I remain discouraged by is the lack of “really excellent and mature sentiment” from any Rabbis. Surely some of them would have the moral courage to criticize Israel’s actions - but if they do they are not getting their voices into the media I’m reading.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Edwards’ sentiment was indeed encouraging. What I remain discouraged by is the lack of “really excellent and mature sentiment” from any Rabbis. Surely some of them would have the moral courage to criticize Israel’s actions &#8211; but if they do they are not getting their voices into the media I’m reading.</p>
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		<title>By: cobernicus</title>
		<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/comment-page-1/#comment-5363</link>
		<dc:creator>cobernicus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 19:18:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/#comment-5363</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;There I agree with you.  The Israeli actions are not necessarily wise, but they are legal.  I feel your comments have been quite balanced.  Some of your FDL colleagues have not shared this viewpoint.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;My point was that the “blockade” has been grossly exaggerated and really been fairly narrow in scope.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There I agree with you.  The Israeli actions are not necessarily wise, but they are legal.  I feel your comments have been quite balanced.  Some of your FDL colleagues have not shared this viewpoint.</p>
<p>My point was that the “blockade” has been grossly exaggerated and really been fairly narrow in scope.</p>
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		<title>By: Spencer Ackerman</title>
		<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/comment-page-1/#comment-5362</link>
		<dc:creator>Spencer Ackerman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 18:06:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;Who’s “denying” anything to Israel? As I wrote earlier, the relevant consideration isn’t justice, it’s &lt;em&gt;wisdom&lt;/em&gt;.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who’s “denying” anything to Israel? As I wrote earlier, the relevant consideration isn’t justice, it’s <em>wisdom</em>.</p>
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		<title>By: cobernicus</title>
		<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/comment-page-1/#comment-5358</link>
		<dc:creator>cobernicus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 12:25:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/#comment-5358</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Regarding the “blockade,” here are some &lt;a href=&quot;http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_spine/archive/2009/01/01/the-truth-about-gaza.aspx&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;figures &lt;/a&gt;about recent events.  Granted, they come from the IDF via Marty Peretz, but they should be easily verified or disproved:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Today (Wed.), 93 truckloads with 2,500 tons of food and medical supplies were transferred to Gaza.&lt;br /&gt;
Since the beginning of the operation in Gaza Saturday, 6,500 tons of food and medicine were transferred to Gaza.&lt;br /&gt;
The World Food Program has informed Israel that they will not be resuming shipment of food into Gaza because their warehouses are at full capacity, with enough supplies for at least 2 weeks.&lt;br /&gt;
12 Palestinians from Gaza entered Israel today (Wed.) for medical treatment.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Also, why is Israel denied the same basic &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.un.org/aboutun/charter/chapter7.shtml&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;rights of self-defense&lt;/a&gt;, including blockades, available to any country that is attacked?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Article 51&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
Nothing in the present Charter shall impair the inherent right of individual or collective self-defence if an armed attack occurs against a Member of the United Nations, until the Security Council has taken measures necessary to maintain international peace and security. Measures taken by Members in the exercise of this right of self-defence shall be immediately reported to the Security Council and shall not in any way affect the authority and responsibility of the Security Council under the present Charter to take at any time such action as it deems necessary in order to maintain or restore international peace and security. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regarding the “blockade,” here are some <a href="http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_spine/archive/2009/01/01/the-truth-about-gaza.aspx" rel="nofollow">figures </a>about recent events.  Granted, they come from the IDF via Marty Peretz, but they should be easily verified or disproved:</p>
<blockquote><p>Today (Wed.), 93 truckloads with 2,500 tons of food and medical supplies were transferred to Gaza.<br />
Since the beginning of the operation in Gaza Saturday, 6,500 tons of food and medicine were transferred to Gaza.<br />
The World Food Program has informed Israel that they will not be resuming shipment of food into Gaza because their warehouses are at full capacity, with enough supplies for at least 2 weeks.<br />
12 Palestinians from Gaza entered Israel today (Wed.) for medical treatment.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Also, why is Israel denied the same basic <a href="http://www.un.org/aboutun/charter/chapter7.shtml" rel="nofollow">rights of self-defense</a>, including blockades, available to any country that is attacked?</p>
<blockquote><p><strong>Article 51</strong><br />
Nothing in the present Charter shall impair the inherent right of individual or collective self-defence if an armed attack occurs against a Member of the United Nations, until the Security Council has taken measures necessary to maintain international peace and security. Measures taken by Members in the exercise of this right of self-defence shall be immediately reported to the Security Council and shall not in any way affect the authority and responsibility of the Security Council under the present Charter to take at any time such action as it deems necessary in order to maintain or restore international peace and security. </p>
</blockquote>
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		<title>By: macaquerman</title>
		<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/comment-page-1/#comment-5356</link>
		<dc:creator>macaquerman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 04:17:16 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;I would suggest not bias, but cant, because the Israelis just wouldn’t do it. The reason for the blockade is to interdict any large weapons shipment to Hamas. If you’re looking to stop rocket attacks from Gaza by bombing ammo dumps and smuggling tunnels, how in hell can you drop the blockade?&lt;br /&gt;
The Israelis won’t, and representatives of our government should be well aware of it. Every other thing she said, as Spencer points out, is well reasoned.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would suggest not bias, but cant, because the Israelis just wouldn’t do it. The reason for the blockade is to interdict any large weapons shipment to Hamas. If you’re looking to stop rocket attacks from Gaza by bombing ammo dumps and smuggling tunnels, how in hell can you drop the blockade?<br />
The Israelis won’t, and representatives of our government should be well aware of it. Every other thing she said, as Spencer points out, is well reasoned.</p>
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		<title>By: OldDog</title>
		<link>http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/comment-page-1/#comment-5355</link>
		<dc:creator>OldDog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Jan 2009 03:25:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/01/02/donnaedwardsongaza/#comment-5355</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Re macaquerman at 1.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I do not see how mention of lifting the Gaza blockade is indicative of cant or bias. Maybe the failure to recognize the blockade as part of the problem would be more indicative of cant.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The following is copied directly from the petition at J Street:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;“I support immediate and strong U.S.-led diplomatic efforts to urgently reinstate a meaningful ceasefire that ends all military operations, stops the rockets aimed at Israel and lifts the blockade of Gaza. This is in the best interests of Israel, the Palestinian people and the United States.”&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re macaquerman at 1.</p>
<p>I do not see how mention of lifting the Gaza blockade is indicative of cant or bias. Maybe the failure to recognize the blockade as part of the problem would be more indicative of cant.</p>
<p>The following is copied directly from the petition at J Street:</p>
<p>“I support immediate and strong U.S.-led diplomatic efforts to urgently reinstate a meaningful ceasefire that ends all military operations, stops the rockets aimed at Israel and lifts the blockade of Gaza. This is in the best interests of Israel, the Palestinian people and the United States.”</p>
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