Huge news from Dafna Linzer and Peter Finn. The Obama administration fears that congressional prerogative is going to get in the way of closing Guantanamo by January. So its answer is to cut Congress out of the decision-making and set up a system of "prolonged detention" for an estimated half of Guantanamo detainees it believes can be neither charged nor responsibly released. My initial read of the Linzer/Finn piece is that what the administration envisions is ratherclose to what Benjamin Wittes is proposing and which my colleague Daphne Eviatar critiqued. [See update below.] (Marcy and Glenn: I defer to your legal minds here.)
Many, many things are curious here, including how much process the unilaterally-created detention system would allow. Finn and Linzer rightfully observe that the logic here is the logic of the Bush administration. There’s not much administration effort, judging from the piece, put into explaining why a detainee can’t be charged with a crime. And then there’s this absolutely bizarre claim:
"Civil liberties groups have encouraged the administration, that if a prolonged detention system were to be sought, to do it through executive order," the official said. Such an order can be rescinded and would not block later efforts to write legislation, but civil liberties groups generally oppose long-term detention, arguing that detainees should either be prosecuted or released.
What? What civil liberties organization actually encouraged the administration to set up a system of "prolonged detention" — the less euphemistic term would be indefinite detention — in the first place; let alone urged the administration to do it without congressional approval?
Update: Zach Roth at TPM reports that the Center for Constitutional Rights certainly doesn’t approve of the idea.
Update 2: CCR representatives say that in a recent White House meeting, they conveyed to administration officials that "any prolonged detention scheme was unacceptable, no matter how it was dressed."
Similar sentiments come from the ACLU, whose executive director, Anthony Romero, has released this statement:
This is not change – this is more of the same. If President Obama issues an executive order authorizing indefinite detention, he’ll be repeating the same mistakes of George Bush, and his policies will be destined to fail as were his predecessor’s. How justice is served in America should not be an open question in a country where we have a rule of law and a time-tested criminal justice system. Throwing people into prison without charge, conviction or providing them with a trial is about as un-American as you can get. While President Obama might be experiencing difficulty with Congress when it comes to implementing his decision to close Guantánamo, the answer is not to issue an executive order authorizing a system which is unconstitutional and counter to the most fundamental American values.
However, Kate Martin of the Center for National Security Policy thinks that contrary to my insta-read above, the executive order reported in Linzer and Finn’s piece doesn’t sound like the Wittes proposal. She doesn’t have any knowledge about the order aside from what she’s read, but says, "If the administration issues an executive order like the one [Linzer and Finn] describe, it’ll be a major victory." That’s because Martin thinks that established law holds that the administration doesn’t require any additional legal authorization to hold anyone captured on the battlefields of Afghanistan without charge until the end of hostilities — that comes from the September 2001 Authorization to Use Military Force, as does dispensation for the 9/11 plotters — but would need to charge or release any detainee picked up outside either Afghanistan or Iraq. Martin thinks the reported executive order might be the only thing standing in the way of an even broader congressional effort of the sort seen in the war supplemental that Daphne critiqued yesterday. Martin has expressed her organization’s longstanding perspective on detainee matters to the administration’s detentions task force.
Update 3: The above reference to Wittes was pretty poorly phrased. I should have written that it seemed like the administration may embrace his substantive proposals for detention. As it reads, my sentence implies that Wittes embraces an executive order as a vehicle to change the rules about detention, when his proposal is obviously a piece of legislation.
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Just read somewhere, but more glanced at a headline, that the draft was presented by some conservative think-tanker, so I don’t know that this is real news. It’s probably just Friday GOPropaganda.
We already know that the dangerousness of a suspect is largely determined in the mind of the average American as a function of, um, complexion. I know I’m committing a scurrilous hypothetical here, but if the Administration has identified half of the remaining detainees as “Too Dark”, how are they supposed to say so on TV?
Seriously though, Obama has built his entire political career on comforting the irrational fears of his constituents without forcing them to examine or abandon those fears. I really do think the potential ‘prolongued detainees’ are just the scary ones, whatever makes them scary.
Still, even with detention and DADT etc., I can’t think of a single civil liberties group that would prefer a permanent Congressional sausage to a Presidential increment.
I can think of at least one so far! CCR’s Shane Kadidal tells Zach from TPM:
I noticed that quote too. The Administration is throwing up a lot of smoke. First, most civil liberties groups should be appalled at any association with or approval of indefinite detention. Second, last I checked there were Democratic majorities in both Houses and a Democratic President. So it is highly unlikely that Congress will propose a detention policy that Obama doesn’t want. The real question is how crappy is the evidence the government has on these guys that even in a federal court where the evidentiary bar is vanishingly low and the likelihood of conviction extremely high that the government doesn’t think it can mount a case against so many Guantanamo detainees?
Ah, but that’s comparing apples to…okay, it’s kind of apples to pears. Still, the first quote unpacks to ‘this is the least harmful way to do this thing’ and the second to ‘all ways of doing this thing are so harmful that it must never be done.’ The two aren’t perfectly complimentary but they’re not in total conflict either.
The argument on it’s face is specious, and only metastasizes into “conventional wisdom” on the basis of being utterly unchallenged. The premise that there are people in custody who cannot be prosecuted and tried, and yet are too dangerous to release is only credible if there are no equivalently dangerous people in the world who are NOT in American custody.
If we assume there are people in the world who are at least as dangerous as these “detainees” (a more foul example of antiseptic post-1984 newspeak I cannot think of), about which we know nothing, or little more than an alias and a manifesto, and yet somehow they have not successfully attacked America or her interests or killed Americans at home or abroad, the thought that people we know intimately, who we have had nearly a decade to study and interrogate, are going to somehow manage to perform more effectively lethal acts of anti-American violence upon their release is simply ludicrous.
American policy, by it’s nature, makes enemies. Some of them committed to violence. We cannot change that, and we are certainly not PREVENTING those acts of violence by throwing our values and constitution in the trash. Many Americans, myself included, lived through horror and spilled blood on foreign soil defending something we believed to be inviolate. The abrogation of this commitment is unacceptable.
There will always be “credible threats”. This isn’t really about THEM. It’s about us. What kind of society we want to live in, and the values we believe transcend mere death…
mikey
Hmmm. Are we now identifying national security and civil liberties?
I hardly know where to start with the official’s statement, but if ever did get going, probably wouldn’t be able to stop for quite a while.
I hit the ceiling when I read about this ‘proposal’ the other evening, and let them know that I wasn’t for it, and consider the whole detention-without-trial thing to be unconstitutional.
I’ve always been uncomfortable with the use by the states of measures that allow them to indefinitely detain certain types of sexual offenders (which types seem to differ by jurisdiction). My view has always been, if they’re still dangers to society after their terms are up then the legislatures need to create laws with long enough statutory terms of detention, to fit the crime, not to allow some type of administrative detention that arbitrarily extends sentences… or, alternatively, medically acknowledge these people to be insane, and commit them to psychiatric facilities where they can really be treated.
Could these indefinite detention measures be related legally to these states’ measures already on the books?
Thank God our founding fathers didn’t have these types around back then because they would have never give the rights listed in the bill of RIGHTS, rights that belong to all people not just exceptional Americans.
Evil people ,the worst of the worst these are examples of dehumanizing language employed to scare joe six pack and it works.
and what’s to prevent them (whether the Feds or the states) from exending this logic to all manner of recidivist felons? “if you can’t be ‘corrected’ by the system, you should be detained indefinitely by it.” Kinda like the rolling ‘maximum’ 3-5 years of administrative detention used in places like China, Singapore and Japan (and in China and Singapore against ‘recidivist’ progressive political critics): detain for the maximum legal interval, let them walk around for a few days, then re-detain them for another maximum interval, etc.
Kagro X (who attended 5/20 WH meeting) says he doesn’t recall anyone encouraging EO
http://www.dailykos.com/storyo…..-detention
They’re using coerced testimony from detainees to incriminate other detainees. It’s about as rotten as you can imagine, and probably a lot worse.
Precedent is what happens to sex offenders after they have served their sentences. They’re probably the first candidates for indefinite imprisonment.
It’s always been my view that extension was the point of installing a system whose essential logic so blatantly was indefinite detention without trial, in the first place.
Now to have the objections of civil libertarians misrepresented as complaints about process is roughly the most offensively bland, gum-you-to-death slop I never hoped to hear from a U.S. government, let alone one I had voted for.
There I go, starting …
I went to a local aclu meeting recently. A group of paroled sex offends was seeking help in finding housing. They didn’t want to touch it without consulting the main folks in Washington (?).
I have never understood how people can be continued to be punished for a crime after serving their sentence. But then along came Bushco. And now the O Admin.
hehe. The rethugs are probably trying to pass off the Heriitage Foundation as a civil rights group ;-P
Orwellian newspeak pr*cks.
I am really tired of the abuse of the english language. I am tired of Enhansed interrogation techniques but just as aggregious is the application of the term terrorist and “the battlefields of Afghanistan”. If someone is taken from a village, in his house and in his bed is that a fricken battlefield?
“Major victory?” Few or none of these detainees was captured on or near the “battlefield” – so long as it’s described as something less than the entire earth.
Further, Ms. Martin’s argument misses the obvious. Prior cases of battlefield detention – as opposed to POW camp detention – assumed an immediate need to contend with prisoners acquired in the midst of rapidly evolving conditions on an active field of battle.
None of those conditions excusing due process and fair treatment for detainees exists in the case of most of these prisoners. Some have been held for seven years, without a properly documented file, without properly documented “interrogations”, and without properly documented, much less credible due process for determining their status, their purported crimes and their fate. They are simply being held in often appalling conditions at the whim of the executive. They might as well be in the Bastille.
The discussion itself is a victory only for an Ueber Secret Government, like a debate over what kind of torture to use. It is no victory for the rule of law or constitutional government. That we have it is a fact that will continue to harm us at home and abroad, which means that it’s not a debate about safety or expediency, it continues to be about the exercise of raw, unchecked power.
also, the right has groups like the Orwellian ACLJ (American Center for Law and Justice), set up to challenge groups like the ACLU with reactionary, conservative interpretations of rights: effectively ‘civil rights’ groups whose job it is to destroy civil liberties. People like Starr, Ashcroft and Jay Sekulowitz have litigated for the ACLJ in the past. They could very well be the group that backed the indefinite detention proposal.
The big difference, of course, is that to be declared a “sex offender” or a “recidivist felon” there was some kind of meaningful trial wherein the accused could question witnesses, contest the evidence presented, and in various other ways demand that the government prove its case against them in a neutral setting according to well-established rules and procedures.
The Gitmo detainees, however, lack any meaningful process like this.
ANY detention without due process is abhorrent to the Constitution, whether for a day, a week, a year, or an indefinite period.
Good point.
BBL when I need to load another audiobook disc on my ipod.
Glenn is upstairs.
Yes, “the battlefield in Afghanistan” is often a goat herder’s bedroom or the interior of a vehicle.
Just last Wednesday, there was a story about the NAACP pleading with Rendell to implement Martial Law in Harrisburg.
We live in interesting times.
Also, if Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley can instantaneously relabel themselves as bank holding companies, what’s to stop the American Enterprise Institute from a quick rebranding as a civil liberties group?
Please, people. Be very careful and read the whole Wittes/Peppard document through, and treat this very, very seriously. Peppard is an advisor to Senator Lieberman and can cash in on credibility from being a former ICRC legal person. Wittes is Brookings when he floats these things and Hoover when he thinks them up. This is a very serious threat to civil liberties and human rights, and it has the ability to become law while people are still laughing at it.
OBTW, the end of the war in Afghanistan was December 5, 2001. The fact that the AUMF is being enshrined in perpetuity is a huge travesty. The fact that they hold people indefinitely on that basis is a slap in the face to humanitarian law, which considers holding people after the end of conflict to be a grave breach (Article 85 section 4(b) 1st Additional Protocol of 1977).