Comments on: Garry Wills Is Barely Even Trying Anymore http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/11/03/wills-to-obama-just-pull-out-of-afghanistan/ Wed, 05 Jan 2011 21:59:36 -0600 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: Teddy Partridge http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/11/03/wills-to-obama-just-pull-out-of-afghanistan/#comment-17133 Teddy Partridge Wed, 04 Nov 2009 18:36:58 +0000 http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/?p=4547#comment-17133 Well, Joe Biden wanted a bigger stimulus, but I guess that's because he lived through his parents' stories about the Great Depression. Direct personal experience cannot come to be the only signifier for decision-making: we must simply insist that American leaders learn from their predecessors' mistakes, whether within living memory or not. Well, Joe Biden wanted a bigger stimulus, but I guess that’s because he lived through his parents’ stories about the Great Depression.

Direct personal experience cannot come to be the only signifier for decision-making: we must simply insist that American leaders learn from their predecessors’ mistakes, whether within living memory or not.

]]> By: ScottMcConnell http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/11/03/wills-to-obama-just-pull-out-of-afghanistan/#comment-17113 ScottMcConnell Tue, 03 Nov 2009 21:26:17 +0000 http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/?p=4547#comment-17113 Wills doesn't want to bore himself by belaboring the obvious. It's like that old saw about arguing about socialism: "your questions are so old I've forgotten the answers". To have to rehearse the arguments again--all the reasons why Afghans will try to kill Americans so long as they're there-- seems incredibly tedioust, though I suppose it's necessary. If Obama was old enough to have lived through Vietnam (and not meanwhile undergone some sort of conversion to neo-conservatism) he wouldn't go near a big commitment to Afghanistan. On what other subject does Joe Biden exhibit greater judgement than Obama? Why do you think that is? Wills doesn’t want to bore himself by belaboring the obvious. It’s like that old saw about arguing about socialism: “your questions are so old I’ve forgotten the answers”. To have to rehearse the arguments again–all the reasons why Afghans will try to kill Americans so long as they’re there– seems incredibly tedioust, though I suppose it’s necessary. If Obama was old enough to have lived through Vietnam (and not meanwhile undergone some sort of conversion to neo-conservatism) he wouldn’t go near a big commitment to Afghanistan. On what other subject does Joe Biden exhibit greater judgement than Obama? Why do you think that is?

]]> By: mikeyhemlok http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/2009/11/03/wills-to-obama-just-pull-out-of-afghanistan/#comment-17111 mikeyhemlok Tue, 03 Nov 2009 19:45:07 +0000 http://attackerman.firedoglake.com/?p=4547#comment-17111 Thank you. Saying "Afghanistan is just like Vietnam" brings no clarity or insight to the discussion. It's intellectually lazy and historically inaccurate. Sure, there are similarities, just as there are to, say, the Soviet adventure in Afghanistan. If these similarities provide enlightenment, fine, use them. But the questions that need to be answered about the American military involvement in Afghanistan are not addressed by grunting out a marginal historical parallel and wandering off to water the plants. Is there an American national security interest in Afghanistan? If so, is it best served by the deployment of military power? If so, what is the appropriate level of commitment, and how is it best utilized? And finally, is there a point where the return on the investment of lives, money and prestige is simply not great enough to justify the expenditure? "Afghanistan is just like Vietnam" provides no insight into these questions... mikey Thank you.

Saying “Afghanistan is just like Vietnam” brings no clarity or insight to the discussion. It’s intellectually lazy and historically inaccurate. Sure, there are similarities, just as there are to, say, the Soviet adventure in Afghanistan. If these similarities provide enlightenment, fine, use them.

But the questions that need to be answered about the American military involvement in Afghanistan are not addressed by grunting out a marginal historical parallel and wandering off to water the plants. Is there an American national security interest in Afghanistan? If so, is it best served by the deployment of military power? If so, what is the appropriate level of commitment, and how is it best utilized? And finally, is there a point where the return on the investment of lives, money and prestige is simply not great enough to justify the expenditure?

“Afghanistan is just like Vietnam” provides no insight into these questions…

mikey

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