Uncle J: We need to build shit. That functions….

Sweet Jesus in a Humvee; what a crock of neo-Bushian gibberish you are pimping, Condoleeza.

We need to get out. 12 months ago. There is NOTHING going on in Iraq to justify any of the pseudo-optimistic snarfing and goorpling that you are inflicting on us with your parsing.

In fact, your threads are so ridiculous that I’m starting to think that you are intentionally putting up this absurd treacle as a parody of anything resembling bottom-line common sense about our getting the hell out of this misery while the getting is as good as it’s going to get.

If I’m right about that, than I herewith tender my apology, but if I’m wrong, and you really believe this recycled warbot oatmeal, then you should apologize to everyone reading it.

Hey! Look at that! Nobody’s keeping you here and speaking for myself, I wouldn’t miss you. I do agree with the get out of Iraq thing but your tone is uncalled for and your scorn is unjustified.

Scorn for military actions of any sort fully warranted IMO. Get the hell out. Whoever thinks the US military has anywhere near the capabilities of accomplishing anything positive in Afghanistan, or that it is in any way necessary, is living in the empire hubris bubble.

Exactly. I like reading things that challenge my perceptions — if nothing else, it makes me work harder to examine them.

tanbark bites, and having bitten, licks his little whizzer, happy as a kitten.

I see you missed the whole point here. Let me replay it for you:

I guess someone could object that Jimbo implies that What Worked In Iraq Will Work In Afghanistan, but I think that’s an uncharitable interpretation of his basic point — which is that people whose families you needlessly kill aren’t gonna be so favorably disposed to diming out your enemies.

Or a clam?

lacks the self-containment of a clam,
but I can envision a tiny head atop a littleneck.

It’s bullshit – but with flavor-ants. What we’re buying are a bunch of war-weary veterans. Killers who will eventually come home with expertise in killing.

The awakening program was in the wings for literally years before the so called “surge”. It only became operable after the civil war/ethnic cleansing of Baghdad that sent the Sunni support structure running for Syria and Jordan and left the insurgency wanting and largely spent. That, the SOFA agreement (withdrawal deadline), and the stand down of the JAM militia, opened up the “surge” alternative that served the mutual purposes of the occupation and what was left of the Sunni insurgency, and ended the formal civil war. Or in other words, the COIN program itself, as a strategy, had little to do with the important developments – the civil war and its aftermath – that changed the game in Iraq. Judging from recent events in Iraq, it’s doubtful that COIN had any positive effects, or ever actually won any hearts and minds. And seeing that Afghanistan has none of the same ethnosectarian fault lines that were exploited in Iraq, the COIN strategy has that much less of a chance of changing the game there.

To all the closet stay the coursers, and most of all, to Ackerman;

One question:

How long do you think we should continue to stay in Afghanistan?

Let the queueing up to answer, begin. :o)

Good vid, the guy is talking straight talk.
2011 might be a good year to get out, but as long as we stay there, Afghanistan will just drain our resources, while it is sitting on 1 Trillion in new resources of its own…

people whose families you needlessly kill aren’t gonna be so favorably disposed to diming out your enemies.

I don’t see how this is a defense of our current strategy, which seems to be counter-insurgency in Afghanistan and counter-terrorism in Pakistan. What good does it do if the (Afghanistan) local population respects us if the (Pakistan) local population is the one with al Qaeda in their backyards?

I could see (if I squint) how a successful Afghan COIN campaign (and a pony!) might make Pakistani government/military/intelligence more willing to cooperate with us, but I can’t really see any possible world where ordinary Pakistanis aren’t going to be enraged at any foreign government that’s conducting drone strikes on their territory, no matter how well targeted.

Ultimately, as long as we’re allied with oil dictatorships in the Islamic world, as long as we give a blank check to Israeli abuses, we will be attacked by Muslim terrorists. That would still be true even if we could wave a magic wand and make al Qaeda and the Taliban disappear.

Phoenix; that’s not the point. The point is, when are we getting out?

Would you like to take a shot at answering that? :o)

Which is this clam asking: would you like to take a shot at answering it without sounding like Condoleeza Rice?

And, just to keep up with the latest:

http://apnews.myway.com//article/20100702/D9GN180G0.html