In 2007 and 2008, there was a presidential candidate who argued that (non-battlefield) indefinite detention without charge was an affront to American values. In 2009, there was a White House that brushed aside reports it would issue an executive order governing (non-battlefield) indefinite detention without charge. Coming in 2011, there’s a White House that will issue an executive order governing (non-battlefield*) indefinite detention without charge. Dafna Linzer reports what it will contain:
If signed by President Obama, the new order will provide added review for detainees designated for long-term detention. The order, which is being drafted jointly by White House staff in the National Security council and the White House counsel, will offer detainees in this category a minimal review every six months and then a more lengthy annual review. Detainees will have access to an attorney, to some evidence against them and the ability to challenge their continued detention.
Just to clarify something: this is for detainees who lose their habeas cases and are still detained (obviously). Nothing currently compels the administration to release or charge those detainees until there’s an additional court ruling demanding it, and it doesn’t look like one would be on the horizon. (Or am I forgetting some current case? Help me out.) Any law passed by Congress on indefinite detention would likely be more onerous, process-wise, to a detainee than this. Still, note this passage in Dafna’s story:
The executive order aims to create an executive branch review which would occur separately from the court review and would weigh the necessity of the detention, rather than its lawfulness, officials said.
“Perhaps the dangerousness of the detainee’s country of origin could change, or the group that the detainee is affiliated with could cease to exist,” one official explained.
In other words: Combatant Status Review Tribunals/Administrative Review Boards 2.0: Now With Lawyers. And that means the executive is going to have to come up with another series of rules, from scratch, to govern this review process. The courts have accepted — to the dismay of civil libertarians — wide prerogative for the executive in detention. But they’ve taken a dim view of ad-hoc solutions.
And there’s a lot of unanswered questions, process-wise, that lend themselves to ad hoc solutions. Who will a lawyer be pleading her client’s case to, here? A judge or an administration official? What role will there be for the courts in reviewing this process, if any? How could a detainee’s counsel successfully argue that he no longer poses a threat? According to the official Dafna quotes, the criterion for determining a detainee’s threat level is inescapably a strategic decision. We’d never leave it for a judge to determine whether, say, Yemen is still a terror-exporting nation. So what’s the point of having a lawyer in the process, if this is an exclusively executive-derived process? None of the above should be construed as an endorsement of the administration’s decisionmaking here, but rather a statement of confusion as to just what system it’s in fact creating for its “Fifth Category” of detainee.
Also: why think this executive order will forestall congressional efforts at codifying an indefinite-detention architecture? Lindsey Graham is going to reintroduce his detention bill in the Senate. Buck McKeon is going to reintroduce his detention bill in the House, where chances are better than even that some indefinite detention bill will pass. The Republicans ran on a platform that included indefinite detention and did very well. Obama ran on a platform that included opposition to indefinite detention, won, and then pursued it anyway. Which of these political forces can we say has more fortitude?
Update, 6:58 p.m.: If I understand the Post’s story correctly, the annual review hearing would be in front of a judge, for a kind of re-habeas-ing. But having made the initial decision that the executive has the right to hold Detainee X, what question is the judge to answer, aside from “Is This Person A Threat?” which is not a judicial decision. If the question is “Is The Government’s Case Against This Person Valid?” congratulations — you’re in trial territory! Which isn’t what this is. What kind of hybrid is Obama creating?
Update, 9:13 p.m.: The judge in question is probs a military judge, right? #speculation



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Two peas in a pod, eh…? 8-(
We can’t believe in anything from Washington anymore. It’s all lies. I can’t believe we put that man in office! I intend to go against any future heads that are presented. We must choose our own leaders!
Ya gotta hand it to Obama! What an accomplishment! In one half of one term, he’s managed to become a worse president than W managed in two full terms. Congratulations Mr. President. I want my money back. You can keep the vote because it’s the last one you’ll ever get from me.
Recommended. We don’t need anymore “black box”-iness from this Administration.
Obama can swallow a pretzel, though. That should count for somthin’
I’ve re-read the Post and the ProPublica pieces several times now Spencer and I’ve yet to find Article III Federal Judges in the mix for that “annual review”.
Habeas petitions, yes. But not for the “annual review”. By my reading, it sures seems that Dafna Linzer is explicit in her saying:
He can probably work a doorknob too though I haven’t seen any evidence of that for myself yet.
That’s it. I’m done with this joker.
Total, complete, utter fraud then and now.
Oh, and Lindsey Graham isn’t going to be introducing anything for a while. He’ll be laying low.
Basically, it just confirms the notion that the aspects of democracy no longer functions. The democratic party and the republican party are both beholden to the same financial and political interestgroups. Why those people insist on indefinite detention I dont understand, but it seems that mr. Obama is no more than a puppet for various lobbies. Wich means that the democratic party needs its own Tea-party movement, wich it will never get because democrats are never able to organize. Theyd much rather blog.
As the wikileaks-cables have shown us, therich and powerful see themselves as a class above the law and above democracy. Its terribly unpopular, but Marx is being proven right in the US these days. But class thinking dies with the Soviet Union, right? Hoho.
Whatever happened to Phil Carter of Intel-Dump, by the way?
He’s been on the down low forever.
M: OT, Glad you are here. I picked up a flyer re. free Training for Medical Office Admins positions. I thought it looked interesting…of course, it’s free. Through ACC: #s to call 512-323-6773, ext.113 for more info. Classes start in Jan. Also info thru the WorkForce commission. You can tell me anytime to leave you alone…
I just went to your post. I cannot tell you how good this news is to me. I cannot tell you how long I have waited for this. You just don’t know how good this is going to be for us Dems in the South!
Don’t leave me alone! Thanks for the phone # :)
RevBev, I think the only person that needs to leave Margaret alone is the same person that needs to leave me alone. It shows up under different names and makes such a huge stink we all leave the room.
perfectly defines the Democratic Difference: atrocious Republican policies, given trivial cosmetic adjustments and baked into bi-partisan, establishment consensus.
thanks for supporting this, Firepups, and you can’t claim “nobody could have predicted.”
Arthur Silbur, from 2006:
indefinite = for evah.
chilling. brrrr
The Haqqani Network. The generals are about to be given permission to cross into Pakistan to wage their illegal war. They aren’t after bin Laden or al Qaeda. They’re after the Haqqani Network. Maulvi Jalauddin Haqqani was once a CIA asset until they tried to kill him. Now he and his son Sirajuddin are in a blood fued with the US government. Good luck trying to assassinate these two people President Shameful. Peace
Oops! Missed one. Now fake habeas corpus.
Can Lindsey Graham-cracker just put a sock in it?
Tax cuts for the rich, a new agency to spy on Americans, betraying his promises on net neutrality and now this. It’s like everyday he feels compelled to give us another reason to HATE him.
obama is much more dangerous than bush.
who knew that when the base chose Obama’s “change you can believe in” over Hillary, that they were choosing a return to the King’s Star Chamber justice.
I am amazed that Obama’s staff are not ashamed of showing their face in public – but then I am also sorry that Hillary has not decided to run against him in 2012 – but I understand the impossibility of a primary challenge given the unwavering support from black caucus Democrats.
I don’t see a political windmill to tilt against in the next 6 years that will gain us anything even if we “win” – the blue dog Dem’s will join the GOP to pass the GOP issues – and those are the issues Obama wants to pass so as to show he is bi-partisan. And Net Neutrality has proven Obama will gut regulation so as to please the GOP.
Indeed I am slowly coming to the conclusion that Democrats will only have a spine once they are opposing a GOP PRESIDENT – making the decision in 2012 very difficult for “president” – although I will still work for just about all individual Democrats.
Not so much seeing that they’re the same guy only with a different skin color. And Hillary would have been no different than either Bush or President Shameful. Her gender would have made not one bit of difference. Fool the blacks, the young and Hispanics. Or fool the women, the young and Hispanics. It’s all the same fraud worked on us by the oligarchy. Maybe they’ll run a two-headed eskimo in 2012. Peace
Hey there, This is Dafna.
I wanted to respond to your comment and hopefully add some clarity to the discussion. The sentence you highlight from my piece about the WH being alone in managing the review process is meant to show that it is the WH acting without consultation of Congress or the courts.
I think the Post may be right about the judge – in fact we reported that in our joint piece in June 09. I just wasn’t sure whether that was staying in this time around. I suspect that if it does, the detainee would come before a military judge since the detainees are held in military detention. But I haven’t confirmed that either. Hope that helps somewhat.
Feel free to email me over at ProPublica with any additional questions and thanks so much for reading our work. And thanks to Spencer of course!
Best, Dafna
Not a surprise, but a Xmas gift to the power elite and the torturer-experimenters and the coupon-clippers for Raytheon, et al. “We’re not ending this terrorism gravy train any time soon.”
Concern at ProPublica and for people like us, champagne corks a-poppin’ in the halls of the powerful.
Barack Obama… his legacy… to have cemented the Executive privilege, nine years after 9/11, to hold anyone indefinitely as long as the Executive deems it appropriate.
I’m going to make a killing selling Magna Carta toilet paper. My reading material tonight? The Man in the Iron Mask
Dafna Linzer, ladies and gentlemen! #honored #ballin
You are surely welcome…
Sure as hell won’t hear about this on Rachel Maddow’s or Olberman’s shows.I just saw a snippet where Maddow is apparently back to telling us how great a Prez Obama is…….absolutely disgusting…I must confess I stopped watching her show months ago but during channel surfing I will inevitable see snatches of her show.
Wonder if the millions of American families in foreclosure or victims of torture or death by war ever make it into these creeps consciousness.
Eli is upstairs!
The FCC’s ‘Totally Convincing’ Explanation For Leaving Wireless Out Of Sham Net Neutrality “Compromise”
For show. They can really play up that aspect of it and claim that they supplied the hopenchange.
So much for the lesser of two evils…
I’m with you. KO is far better than Rachel, but both have a tendency to come down hard once in a while, say while an issue is red hot, then a few days later they’re on to new things and back to the cheering section. I’ll know that things have changed when Dems start showing up on “Worst Persons” and KO starts doing nightly comments condemming Obama as he used to with Bush. Not freakin’ likely.
Yep. Lots of evil and not much lesser.
I agree,Olberman is marginally better than Maddow.
Special comment from Olberman,those were a weekly occurrence when Bush was the Prez…….Obama has adopted most of Bush policies & the special comment ,welll,er magically disappeared.
OK: so a lot of you have wisened up to Obama and may be rid of him in 2 years.
Great.
But what will prevent you from being duped by someone else?
Obama is gone but you will still be there.
Or have you learned that electoral politics is only a tertiary part of the citizen’s duties?